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mtx terminator subs and amp plz help with setting up

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mtx terminator subs and amp plz help with setting up

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 this is what i have 2 mtx terminator subs with amp subs are 600 watts peak 200 watts rms there 4 ohm speakers the amp is 200 watts rms at 2 ohms. i blew the last pair i had by cranking the settings to high. i love loud bass but dont want to blow these again i have an alpine head unit that from what i understand throws 4 volts. i have the settings on the amp at half power gain is at half and doubl bass boast is at 6. my bass setting on my head unit is -2 -3 i cant turn down the amp anymore and let my head unit do the work cauz at postive 2 or 3 on the head unit distorts the speakers in the car. i want to have loud bass but dont want to blow these again because in the summer im upgrading my system to 2 1500 wat rms power acoustic mofo seris subs. i know them will be load as  <Mod Edit: Language> so plz any info to clue me on on how to set these or anything would really help.



[edited by: TigerHeli at 2:01 PM (GMT -5) on Thu, Feb 4 2010] shit

Alpine CDA-9825, pioneer 5 1/4s, Kenwood 6by9s KFC-6909S, 2 12in Mtx terminators TNP212D, Mtx terminator amp TN250/1, Jvc 2 channel amp KS-AX3002, Jvc 2 channel KS-AX4302, 1 sound led reactive light

Verified Answer
  • First off you're only feeding 50-70% of the power your subs are made for depending on your amps true output. This would allow them to distort when pushed harder at louder volume levels. I can only assume you blew the others by sending them a clipped signal. What's the actual output of your amp? I know it's rated at 200RMS @ 2Ohms, but you should have a certificate that says what your amp actually puts out.

    I couldn't find any info on what the input voltage limit is on the RCA's, but I going to figure you have the gain too high which helped lead to the clipping. If your other speakers are distoring then they need to either be amped or have their cut off frequencies adjusted. You could also turn the speakers output to -6dB or more so they don't get as loud and distort sooner on higher volume levels.

    Also, are your subs in a sealed or ported enclosure? Ported would help give you the loud boom you want, but your amp doesn't have a subsonic filter, so your subs would go wild when trying to play frequencies below the box's tuning frequency which would only hasten their demise. What's your boxes specs and the actual model number of the subs.

    Lastly, what amp do you plan to use with the Power Acoustic subs? I highly doubt they'll handle their rated 1500RMS and weather or not they will, your current amp is a very poor choice to power them as I'm sure feeding them less than 500RMS each would cause them to clip.

All Replies
  • Not real sure what you are looking for - if the subs are 200W RMS SVC-4-ohm and your amp is 200W RMS@2-ohms, you will be giving them 50% power and CF recommends 70%, but that will work fine if you are careful with the gains and don't send them a clipped signal, but they won't be as loud as they could be with a bigger amp.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • First off you're only feeding 50-70% of the power your subs are made for depending on your amps true output. This would allow them to distort when pushed harder at louder volume levels. I can only assume you blew the others by sending them a clipped signal. What's the actual output of your amp? I know it's rated at 200RMS @ 2Ohms, but you should have a certificate that says what your amp actually puts out.

    I couldn't find any info on what the input voltage limit is on the RCA's, but I going to figure you have the gain too high which helped lead to the clipping. If your other speakers are distoring then they need to either be amped or have their cut off frequencies adjusted. You could also turn the speakers output to -6dB or more so they don't get as loud and distort sooner on higher volume levels.

    Also, are your subs in a sealed or ported enclosure? Ported would help give you the loud boom you want, but your amp doesn't have a subsonic filter, so your subs would go wild when trying to play frequencies below the box's tuning frequency which would only hasten their demise. What's your boxes specs and the actual model number of the subs.

    Lastly, what amp do you plan to use with the Power Acoustic subs? I highly doubt they'll handle their rated 1500RMS and weather or not they will, your current amp is a very poor choice to power them as I'm sure feeding them less than 500RMS each would cause them to clip.

  • Ok, first off, I know from experience that the Mofo's won't actually handle the 1500 rms constantly, so I'd run anywhere from 750-1k to them instead. If you need a diagram of how to wire them up for 2 ohms or 4 ohms, I can also get you that too.

    2000 Ford Mustang - Alpine CDA 9886, Alpine Type-X 12", PA OVN1-4000D

  • I assumed the OP was going to get a new amp for the PA subs, but it didn't hurt to mention that - trying to run them off 200W would NOT be a good idea.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • TNE212D

    TN250/1

    <Mod Edit: Linked to Manufacturer's site. Please link to Crutchfield's Item Page or manufacturer's website. Thanks.>

     this is the website of my subs and amp and box combo. and im looking at getting a 3000 watt amp for the power acoustic subs that throws 1300 watts i will get the certificate when i can its in my box at home but theres my specs i really dont understand that much about subs but how can u clip them if the amp is under the power of what the subs are rated if u could plz share some more info on distroting and clipping i would really appreciate it 



    [edited by: TigerHeli at 8:17 AM (GMT -5) on Sat, Feb 6 2010] http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_12216_MTX+Audio+Terminator+TNP212D.html

    Alpine CDA-9825, pioneer 5 1/4s, Kenwood 6by9s KFC-6909S, 2 12in Mtx terminators TNP212D, Mtx terminator amp TN250/1, Jvc 2 channel amp KS-AX3002, Jvc 2 channel KS-AX4302, 1 sound led reactive light

  • o really they dont run that? i was gonna get a 3000 watt gothic series 1300 rms watt amp with ported/vented box any info u can give me on these subs would be great thanks

    Alpine CDA-9825, pioneer 5 1/4s, Kenwood 6by9s KFC-6909S, 2 12in Mtx terminators TNP212D, Mtx terminator amp TN250/1, Jvc 2 channel amp KS-AX3002, Jvc 2 channel KS-AX4302, 1 sound led reactive light

    • 2 12" Terminator Series Subwoofers Included
    • Power Handling:
      • Peak: 1200 watts per pair / 600 watts each sub
      • RMS: 400 watts per pair / 200 watts each sub
    • 2" Aluminum single 4 ohms voice coil
    • Rubber Surround
    • Polypropylene Cone
    • MTX Audio Logo on Dustcap
    • 48oz. Magnet
    • Frequency response: 37-150 Hz
    • Terminator Series Class D Monoblock Car Amplifier
    • RMS Power Rating:
      • 2 ohms: 200 watts x 1 chan.
    • Max power output: 400 watts x 1 chan.
    • LED power and protection indicators
    • Selectable bass boost (0, 6, 12 dB at 40 Hz)
    • Mono gain control
    • Smart engage auto turn-on circuitry
    • Built-in adaptive cooling fans
    • Fixed low-pass filter (85 Hz, 18 dB/octave)
    • CEA-2006 compliant amplifier
    • Frequency response: 20-85 Hz
    • Dimensions: 13-1/16"L x 10-3/16"W x 2-1/4"H
    • Dual 12" Sealed Sub Enclosure
    • 5/8" MDF Solid Contruction
    • Durable Black Carpeting
    • Terminator Logo Embroidered into Carpet Front
    • Dimensions: 14"H x 29-1/2"W x 13-1/2"D1 x 11"D2

    Alpine CDA-9825, pioneer 5 1/4s, Kenwood 6by9s KFC-6909S, 2 12in Mtx terminators TNP212D, Mtx terminator amp TN250/1, Jvc 2 channel amp KS-AX3002, Jvc 2 channel KS-AX4302, 1 sound led reactive light

  • Here's a rough explanation of clipping I borrowed from another site.

  • Here ya go, take a look at this. It should help you as to how to wire them up. http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/rftech/woofer_wizard.asp

     PA amps are pretty reliable, but my friend had the Mofo's and he ran 600 watts rms and they did fine, he hooked them up to a Kicker 1000.1 and blew them both.

     



    [edited by: 19Delta at 11:00 PM (GMT -5) on Thu, Feb 4 2010]

    2000 Ford Mustang - Alpine CDA 9886, Alpine Type-X 12", PA OVN1-4000D

  • yeah that makes alot of since on one website i seen that digram of the clipping but there was no words telling me how to understand it but it makes since since the amp from what i get out of it throws 100 watts rms at 4 ohms and the speakers are rated for 200 watts when the amp gets maxed out or something. still dont 100 percent get it but what u said makes alot of since and thats prolly how i blew the last pair i had. but i tell u what was weird about it is i had these things kicking hard i had the double bass at 12 and the gain at about 3/4 of the way and base on my unit and -7 i ran them for 5 days hard and they pounded. then i was an idiot and turned the gain just a notch more they pounded. i shut my car off. one thing i did when i shut it off i didnt turn the music down at all turned it off. then when i started it back up is when i found out they blew. why wouldnt they blow when in power? geeze theres so much to know about subs and amps its crazy!!!



    [edited by: zdub2004 at 10:09 AM (GMT -5) on Fri, Feb 5 2010]

    Alpine CDA-9825, pioneer 5 1/4s, Kenwood 6by9s KFC-6909S, 2 12in Mtx terminators TNP212D, Mtx terminator amp TN250/1, Jvc 2 channel amp KS-AX3002, Jvc 2 channel KS-AX4302, 1 sound led reactive light

  • i really appreciate all the help and answering my questions. im kinda a newb when it comes to subs and amps. but i really love the sound and am becoming a huge fan in car audio nothing in my car audio is stock at all that was the first thing to go when i got my car. i really thank yall for taking the time in writing all this stuff.. so bottom line if i got a bigger amp it would help my subs a little more? i put the specs of my subs in a post up top if anyone recomends any amps for me? thanks a bunch

    Alpine CDA-9825, pioneer 5 1/4s, Kenwood 6by9s KFC-6909S, 2 12in Mtx terminators TNP212D, Mtx terminator amp TN250/1, Jvc 2 channel amp KS-AX3002, Jvc 2 channel KS-AX4302, 1 sound led reactive light

  • Any amp that puts out 400-500RMS@2Ohms should be perfect for your subs. The extra 50RMS per sub just gives a little head room and so long as you set the gain correctly helps ensure your subs won't clip at higher volume levels. You can make your 200RMS amp work, but it's not going to allow your subs to see their true potential. As you've found out, when you tried to squeeze every bit of power out of that under powered amp to get your subs as loud as possible it killed your subs. Browsing Crutchfield I found the following amps that would suit your needs.

    Kenwood KAC-8104D at $150 it's the cheapest one that Crutchfield carries that I feel is a good match. It's CEA certified at 500RMS@2Ohms, so it's got more than enough power and so long as your gain is set correctly it should pound the hell out of those subs. I also like that it has a selectable 25Hz subsonic filter since your subs can't play down real low and you'll probably enjoy the variable 18dB bass boost.

    Sound Ordnance M-1500 at $160 may be a good buy too, but I've never heard of them before. It's a 500RMS amp too, but isn't CEA Certified, so it may or may not actually put that out. I do like that it has a variable subsonic filter, but that's about it. The bass boost it either off or 12dB which I don't like as it, IMO, could be too much bass when activated, but not enough with it off.

    Orion Cobalt CO8001 at $170 isn't a bad choice either.It's the only one rated at a perfect match of 400RMS@2Ohms and is CEA Certified so you'll have just a smidgen of head room. It's bass boost is 0,6dB, or 12dB selectable which gives you some choice, but not a lot. I know I've heard good things about Orion subs before, but never have heard much about their amps. Also, it doesn't have a subsonic filter, which isn't a make or break deal since your subs aren't in a ported box, but it'd be nice feature to have IMO.

    Lastly the Alpine MRP-M500 at $200. I've been an Alpine fan for some time now, so I'd be inclined to go with this, although I kinda feel it's a step down from their older amps. It's CEA Certified at 500RMS@2ohms, so you'll have plenty of power, it's bass boost is variable from 0-12dB, an it's cross over slope is 24dB/octave (which is nice). It does have a 15Hz subsonic filter, but that awfully low IMO. Lastly, it's a D class amp, which is easier on the vehicle's electrical system than AB class amps (sorry, forgot to see what class all the other were) and best of all, it's Alpine (Yea, I'm a little bias).

    Any of these amps will work fine power wise, the only question is their reliability. Like I said, I've never heard anything on Orion or Sound ordnance  amps before, so they may be great, they may be junk, I honestly don't know. The Kenwood is easily the best bag for the buck, I'm just not a Kenwood fan (they lost me around 1999 when all their unreliable HU's were around). Although I've heard many good things about a lot of their newer gear. The choice is yours. You can choose one of these or find something else (and ask us about it if you like).

    EDIT

    I though I read your subs play down to 27Hz, but it's 37Hz. Being in a sealed enclosure it isn't as vital to have a subsonic filter, but it sure is nice and given how high your subs lowest playable frequency is at. You may want to try finding some way to filter frequencies below 35Hz that'll rob power from your amp without giving you any good musical output. I know there's people on a certain popular four letter auctioning site that starts with an E that make and sell low/high pass in-line filters, but I don't know if they are able to handle the power output of the amps above. There's one guy that says he can make them at ANY cut off frequency and at any slope, but you'd have to find him and ask if they'll handle the power.

    2nd Edit

    I accidentally said 4 Ohms instaed of 2 Ohms in the first sentence, which I have now corrected. I'm trying to give some helpful advise to a guy with two 8ohm subs as well and keep mixing the two ohms up on these subs.



    [edited by: Weigel21 at 12:11 PM (GMT -5) on Sat, Feb 6 2010]
  • zdub2004
    this is the website of my subs and amp and box combo.

    And also a violation of our forum policy.  Not uncommon for competitors to sell underpowered sub/amp combos (although CF has done this also on some of their entry-level packages).

    u could plz share some more info on distroting and clipping i would really appreciate it

    See this. (and also the links to the Audiojunkies page).  (Can't explain it better than Weigel21 did - although I've heard that analogy before).

    o really they dont run that? i was gonna get a 3000 watt gothic series 1300 rms watt amp with ported/vented box any info u can give me on these subs would be great thanks

    Look at it this way - some companies (PA) overrate their gear, some companies (Kicker) under-rate it.

    If you hook up a 1500W RMS PA amp to 1500W RMS PA subs, it works fine, but the amp is maybe only putting out 1000W.

    If you hook up a 750W Kicker amp, to 750W Kicker sub, it works fine, but the amp is maybe putting out 1000W.

    Hook up the 750W Kicker amp to 750W PA subs and you have a problem b/c the amp is putting out 1000W and the sub can maybe handle 500W.

    That was over-simplified, but you get the idea.

    i shut my car off. one thing i did when i shut it off i didnt turn the music down at all turned it off. then when i started it back up is when i found out they blew.

    Voltage spike when the car turned on or off - maybe - just a WAG here, but ....

    Hope This Helps!!!

     

     

     

     

     

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs