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Which amp for dual 12" Pioneer shallow mount subs?

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Which amp for dual 12" Pioneer shallow mount subs?

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Im looking at purchasing two Pioneer TS-SW3001S4 shallow mount subs. They will be mounted in a 2005 Chevrolet Silverado crew-cab, using a dual downfire box under the rear seat. These subs are 4 ohm, but are also offered in a 2 ohm version (which should I go with?) I need to know what kind of amp to pair with these subs for best overall performance. Pioneer offers a class-D amp (GM-D8500M) with 300watts at 4 ohms. Would that be sufficient? I am new to the audio field, so thanks for any replies and help!



[edited by: JayRod at 11:55 PM (GMT -5) on Sun, Apr 22 2012]
Verified Answer
  • The subs are rated 400W RMS each.

    Your best option would be the SVC-4-ohm versions as there are more amplifiers to choose from that are 600-1000W RMS at 2-ohms.

    The SVC-2-ohm versions would pair well with a Hifonics HFi1000D or similar amp at 1-ohm.

    To find an amp with that kind of power output at 4-ohms, you would be looking at a bridged 2-channel amp - which is not ideal for subwoofers.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

All Replies
  • Which version of the sub really depends on you. The 4 ohm versions can be wired as a 2 ohm load to the amp and the 2 ohm versions can be wired as a 1 ohm or 4 ohm load to the amp. Either way, you need an amp that outputs 600-1000 watts at the impedance you end up with.

    GLH Geeked

  • The subs are rated 400W RMS each.

    Your best option would be the SVC-4-ohm versions as there are more amplifiers to choose from that are 600-1000W RMS at 2-ohms.

    The SVC-2-ohm versions would pair well with a Hifonics HFi1000D or similar amp at 1-ohm.

    To find an amp with that kind of power output at 4-ohms, you would be looking at a bridged 2-channel amp - which is not ideal for subwoofers.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • TigerHeli

    The subs are rated 400W RMS each.

    Your best option would be the SVC-4-ohm versions as there are more amplifiers to choose from that are 600-1000W RMS at 2-ohms.

    The SVC-2-ohm versions would pair well with a Hifonics HFi1000D or similar amp at 1-ohm.

    To find an amp with that kind of power output at 4-ohms, you would be looking at a bridged 2-channel amp - which is not ideal for subwoofers.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

     

    Would the Kicker 11DX500.1 be enough to sound good? I had a guy suggest that at a local audio store, but don't know much about "ohms" and the ratings. If I get the 4 ohm shallow mount Pioneers, is this amp only going to supply them with 275 watts RMS? Thanks!

  • If you get the SVC-4-ohm subs, you would wire them in parallel for 2-ohms at the amp.  The amp is RATED 500W RMS at 2-ohms, so they subs would see 500W combined (250W each) out of 800W rated, or 63% of RMS and Crutchfield recommends at least 70% (but 40% would be "acceptable").

    Kicker seriously underrates their amps, though.  For instance, the amp is Class D with 60A of onboard fusing.  That implies the amp might put out more like 650W - or 81% of RMS.

    It's going to be better than most 500W amps, but probably not as good as say, the Kenwood KAC-9105D with 90A of fuses for the same price on Crutchfield.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • TigerHeli

    If you get the SVC-4-ohm subs, you would wire them in parallel for 2-ohms at the amp.  The amp is RATED 500W RMS at 2-ohms, so they subs would see 500W combined (250W each) out of 800W rated, or 63% of RMS and Crutchfield recommends at least 70% (but 40% would be "acceptable").

    Kicker seriously underrates their amps, though.  For instance, the amp is Class D with 60A of onboard fusing.  That implies the amp might put out more like 650W - or 81% of RMS.

    It's going to be better than most 500W amps, but probably not as good as say, the Kenwood KAC-9105D with 90A of fuses for the same price on Crutchfield.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

     

    Thankyou for helping explain things! So if I were to go with the kicker 500.1 DX series, would it still sound decent, or do you think it would work the amp too hard? Also how does Rockford's quality compare to Kicker? I found a Rockford Fosgate R1200-1D which supplies 400RMS at 4 ohms. That's exactly what the SVC shallow pioneers are rated for. Would that be a good match up? Thanks!

  • You are missing some of the finer points, but that's okay.

    The Kicker would definitely sound decent - but you would want to set the gain to limit the amp output to 650W.  You wouldn't be working the amp too hard, but you wouldn't be sending the full 800W that the subs are rated for either.  (And the 650W would be a guesstimate at best - in reality, you would want to set the gain with an oscilloscope rather than a DMM, but not all shops even have those.)

    The R1200-1D is indeed 400W at 4-ohms, which would be perfect for powering ONE Pioneer sub, but you have two subs, if I understood, so that really doesn't matter and you need the power rating at 2-ohms.  In this case, that is fine b/c the amp is also rated a perfect 800W at 2-ohms and 1200W RMS at 1-ohm (for growth if you went with different compatible subs later.)

    Rockford USED to be among the highest quality amps you could buy (in the 80's) - they slipped a bit but are back now, but this is their Prime or entry-level amp, so it won't have the quality of say their T-series amps.  Also, the amp has no onboard fuses, so it is a bit hard to evaluate what it really does, but RF generally makes at least if not more than rated power, so I wouldn't worry about that.

    There is also an advantage in that since the amp if reliably rated at 800W RMS, you can set the gain for that and be sure the amp will supply that and more.

    All things being equal, I'd probably go with the Rockford over the Kicker in this case.

    BTW - I believe both Rockford and Kicker used to add a year's warranty on the amp if you use one of their wiring kits and buy from an authorized dealer.  Not sure if that still applies, but it's not a bad idea to try it anyway.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • TigerHeli

    You are missing some of the finer points, but that's okay.

    The Kicker would definitely sound decent - but you would want to set the gain to limit the amp output to 650W.  You wouldn't be working the amp too hard, but you wouldn't be sending the full 800W that the subs are rated for either.  (And the 650W would be a guesstimate at best - in reality, you would want to set the gain with an oscilloscope rather than a DMM, but not all shops even have those.)

    The R1200-1D is indeed 400W at 4-ohms, which would be perfect for powering ONE Pioneer sub, but you have two subs, if I understood, so that really doesn't matter and you need the power rating at 2-ohms.  In this case, that is fine b/c the amp is also rated a perfect 800W at 2-ohms and 1200W RMS at 1-ohm (for growth if you went with different compatible subs later.)

    Rockford USED to be among the highest quality amps you could buy (in the 80's) - they slipped a bit but are back now, but this is their Prime or entry-level amp, so it won't have the quality of say their T-series amps.  Also, the amp has no onboard fuses, so it is a bit hard to evaluate what it really does, but RF generally makes at least if not more than rated power, so I wouldn't worry about that.

    There is also an advantage in that since the amp if reliably rated at 800W RMS, you can set the gain for that and be sure the amp will supply that and more.

    All things being equal, I'd probably go with the Rockford over the Kicker in this case.

    BTW - I believe both Rockford and Kicker used to add a year's warranty on the amp if you use one of their wiring kits and buy from an authorized dealer.  Not sure if that still applies, but it's not a bad idea to try it anyway.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

     

     

    Ok. Thanks for all the help, I really appreciate it. And sorry for any misunderstandings I have. I think I'm going to end up going with the Kicker 500.1 DX series though. And That extended warranty with their wiring kit still stands I believe. This is my first time trying to put together something for my silverado, and didn't want to rush into it blind haha. I will let you know how it turns out. Thanks again!

  • JayRod
    I think I'm going to end up going with the Kicker 500.1 DX series though.

    Why?  Not that it's a bad choice, but the RF seemed like a better match and had more growth potential, so I'm curious ...

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • TigerHeli

    JayRod
    I think I'm going to end up going with the Kicker 500.1 DX series though.

    Why?  Not that it's a bad choice, but the RF seemed like a better match and had more growth potential, so I'm curious ...

     

    No reason really, I've just heard a lot of good things about kicker and if it sounds good, then I'll be happy. Plus it has the fuses in the amp. If you think I should go with the RF I can do that too, I just thought I would choose kicker from their good reputation.

  • JayRod
    Plus it has the fuses in the amp.

    I maybe misled you a bit on that.  The Kicker has 60A of fusing, which is more than needed for a 500W Class D amp, so I approximated that it would probably do 650W.  The Kenwood has 90A of fusing and should do around 900W.  Now if I am looking at a flea-market brand amp and it claims it will do 600W RMS but only has a 30A fuse onboard, it throws up a red flag.  If I am looking at a flea-market brand amp and it claims it will do 600W and it has NO onboard fuses, it throws up a bigger red flag.

    RF is known for producing more than rated power, so it not having the fuses onboard is not that much of a concern to me (other than some additional hassle and cost).

    JayRod
    If you think I should go with the RF I can do that too

    The subs are 800W RMS.  The RF amp is AT LEAST 800W RMS, likely more.  The Kicker amp is AT LEAST 500W RMS, maybe 650W.  The RF amp is also 1-ohm stable and rated for 1200W RMS at 1-ohm, the Kicker is not.

    JayRod
    kicker from their good reputation

    They actually both have a great reputation - you're matching RF's value line against Kicker's mainstream amps, but you are also looking at a more powerful amp.

    Hope This Helps!!!

    Anyone else have suggestions?

     

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • Ok cool. Either way will work but that RF does sound like a pretty good amp.. I'll order an amp and subs probably the end of this week. Thanks for throwing ideas my way and helping out!

  • Glad to help - one of the other forum members might be better on the amp choice as well.  On PAPER, the RF looks a lot better, but that doesn't always translate to the real world.

    Anyone else have suggestions?

    2002 Ford Focus JVC KD-A815 Sony CDX-GT410u Sony XT-100HD HD Tuner Stock speakers, no amp, no subs

  • i like the idea of running a 1 ohm stable amp that makes the power you currently need at 2 ohms.  the amp will run cooler, and in the tight confines of a Silverado cab that may mean more flexible mounting options since it will need less room for cooling.  the damping rate will also be better (not a very important spec when just running subs, but better is well, better!). also, you could add another pair of subs to it, or upgrade later to more powerful subs and the same amp would work.

    can't imagine the Kicker amp would let you down, tho.  the decision may simply come down to which one fits the allocated space for the amp best!